tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post6687828569310285878..comments2024-02-13T02:39:22.756-05:00Comments on EconomicPolicyJournal.com: Voting For Liberty...Forget It!Robert Wenzelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14296920597416905488noreply@blogger.comBlogger37125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-1154336153250156292012-11-29T14:56:08.199-05:002012-11-29T14:56:08.199-05:00Voting for better politicians does not mean you ap...Voting for better politicians does not mean you approve of them. It means you think they are better than the others and you think they will hurt you less than the others. This doesn't mean you can no longer act as though you want someone else running your life. Many people on here are missing Wenzel's point. At least in this article, he is not saying that voting is bad to do or that Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-23266922647807316192012-11-29T14:45:58.365-05:002012-11-29T14:45:58.365-05:00Then what is your solution? War? Sticking your he...Then what is your solution? War? Sticking your head in the sand like an ostrich isn't going to accomplish anything.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-75428766686617615772012-11-29T12:51:18.620-05:002012-11-29T12:51:18.620-05:00Mr. Conant, that is a more interesting metaphor th...Mr. Conant, that is a more interesting metaphor than I think you intended. Isn't to what you compare exactly what under-cover police do in order to gather evidence for the purpose of making arrests, indictments, trials and convictions of Mafiosi? And in any event, what other means should peaceful citizens use to dismantle a mafia presence in their areas? Blog about them? Seems like a good wayEllis Wyattnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-29247957014554194342012-11-29T04:30:39.015-05:002012-11-29T04:30:39.015-05:00This sounds like more of a defeat in your own mind...This sounds like more of a defeat in your own mind than in reality. I know a lot more people that will openly say that the government is a bunch of assholes than I know people. That doesn't stop them from being a bunch of assholes that I've seen. It sounds a lot like writing the phrase "you're dead to me" in the memo line of a check to the IRS. Might make you feel betterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-81681287434047315182012-11-28T23:10:55.959-05:002012-11-28T23:10:55.959-05:00Goods for you Chris.
Voting is for people that a...Goods for you Chris. <br /><br />Voting is for people that are too ignorant to see that "The Elite" control the system, and only "withdrawal of consent" (which not voting is a first step) is the only way to topple their evil system. <br /><br />Voting is just perpetuating the "INEPTOCRACY" aka the election of the least competent, by the least competent, to perform Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-25516128537636828612012-11-28T23:04:44.197-05:002012-11-28T23:04:44.197-05:00"The Statists" only rule because they be..."The Statists" only rule because they believe the majority have given consent. The more of us that refuse to be fooled by their bullshit and refuse to consent, the more illegitimate their rule is, and the less "the sheeple" venerate it as legitimate. Once the majority give up their belief in the validity of majority rule by the moronocracyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-27650160860255955282012-11-28T22:46:54.443-05:002012-11-28T22:46:54.443-05:00Excellent article. You have not fully woken up un...Excellent article. You have not fully woken up until you reject electoral politics. In my opinion, this is the hardest spell to break. People get so angry when they find out you don't believe in voting. They want the One Ring. They wouldn't throw it into the lava pit.Ed Ucationhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15375062362847706272noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-47340192279310737302012-11-28T22:16:55.229-05:002012-11-28T22:16:55.229-05:00"To get on to voting, yes I believe that any ..."To get on to voting, yes I believe that any legislator who votes for a tax or an aggressive law is illicitly participating in a criminal enterprise, but no I don't believe that the citizen voter necessarily does so. There's votes and there's votes. One problem with your view is that, in an important sense, it is not anti-statist enough. There is no real sense that we are all of Davehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10579799109070553474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-46699832131793260132012-11-28T20:49:26.835-05:002012-11-28T20:49:26.835-05:00Right, Tony. It is ultimately a failure of imagina...Right, Tony. It is ultimately a failure of imagination, a failure to actually understand the message of liberty. Bastiat sums up that message best:<br /><br />"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-76484527495116034462012-11-28T20:43:50.761-05:002012-11-28T20:43:50.761-05:00It does not boil down to that.
It boils down to,...It does not boil down to that. <br /><br />It boils down to, "Do you want to act as if you want and accept someone else running your life, or do you want to act as a free and independent human being?"<br /><br />If the former, by all means vote. If the latter, then chart your own course and accept no master (you may have to pick your battles, but you are still making those conscious Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-23393142641810572082012-11-28T20:05:06.398-05:002012-11-28T20:05:06.398-05:00I guess it boils down to this. Would you rather ha...I guess it boils down to this. Would you rather have Rand Paul or Mitch McConnell? Would you rather have Rand Paul or John McCain?<br /><br />I know, I know, none, but that's not practical. I think the answer is obvious!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-21852523266441369042012-11-28T18:53:27.358-05:002012-11-28T18:53:27.358-05:00I do not think we'll ever have the numbers to ...I do not think we'll ever have the numbers to win elections. Too many people depend on the system. The easiest way to win elections is to lie your ass off and promise special favors to big donors. <br /><br />I treat the State like a pothole, by trying to avoid it, and educating others about its evils. I voted for Ron Paul. Big deal.Wagsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-87366042994821344692012-11-28T18:35:48.619-05:002012-11-28T18:35:48.619-05:00There should be a Constitutional provision that no...There should be a Constitutional provision that no Senator or representative can be seated from any state if there are any ways to designate political parties on the ballot. If a state doesn't like that, it can withdraw from the United States.mcfrandyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01642680868453105592noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-69538812510423101812012-11-28T18:31:40.186-05:002012-11-28T18:31:40.186-05:00If republican government wants legitimacy, it need...If republican government wants legitimacy, it needs to stop putting parties on the ballot. That should be a Constitutional rule, otherwise no Senators or representatives could be seated from any state.mcfrandyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01642680868453105592noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-86473527076487692662012-11-28T18:29:43.931-05:002012-11-28T18:29:43.931-05:00Explain to me this: how do the statists "adm...Explain to me this: how do the statists "admit defeat"? What, exactly, does that look like? Do they just wake up one day and say "Hey Bob, you know what, let's just abandon our posts and go home"? No statist in a position of power will voluntarily give up their power. Bastiat talked about the human disposition for sloth and legal plunder almost 200 years ago. I don&#Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-38971491745523524732012-11-28T17:23:07.300-05:002012-11-28T17:23:07.300-05:00@ Anon 3:16
No, no, no. You just don't get it...@ Anon 3:16<br /><br />No, no, no. You just don't get it. If we libertarians refuse to participate in politics, then the statists will admit defeat. It's a historical fact that we didn't have states until all the libertarians decided to vote.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-57570865478770369782012-11-28T16:37:10.052-05:002012-11-28T16:37:10.052-05:00LOL, "CFA".LOL, "CFA". <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-33311014259774208772012-11-28T16:08:20.967-05:002012-11-28T16:08:20.967-05:00@Geoff: I thought it was a non-crap article myself...@Geoff: I thought it was a non-crap article myself...and I think private property is key too. Can't we have two allies? Or do you believe that voting is a better way to achieve stronger private property rights vs. "spontaneous order"?<br /><br />Off topic: Gotta love Brit PM parsing his words in feign support of private property rights. "The golden thread is...the absence of Arthur Krolman, CFAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-5875795364158716942012-11-28T15:38:56.526-05:002012-11-28T15:38:56.526-05:00Oops, thanks for pointing that out. I ignored the ...Oops, thanks for pointing that out. I ignored the rest after readin the first sentence. Probably due to my filtering out stupidity when I read it...maybe he should have place it in quotes first or something.<br /><br />Anyway, thanks for making me feel stupid(deservedly).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-57232968140921685382012-11-28T15:16:38.726-05:002012-11-28T15:16:38.726-05:00And might point is that if Wenzel and Rossini are ...And might point is that if Wenzel and Rossini are correct, that politics is just a platform to educate people, and that educating people is the only way to achieve liberty, won't those educated people eventually start voting for those liberty candidates? Politics ceases to become just a platform. What if we had more Justin Amashes or more Ron Pauls in Congress? Wouldn't politics be a Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-32902245192280959402012-11-28T15:12:27.505-05:002012-11-28T15:12:27.505-05:00And your non-existent reading comprehension skills...And your non-existent reading comprehension skills didn't allow you put that statement in context. The next sentence qualifies the statement: "That is how politicians view non-voters."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-75128019673994466272012-11-28T14:56:56.237-05:002012-11-28T14:56:56.237-05:00"Silence is assent."
You didn't eve..."Silence is assent."<br /><br />You didn't even get one sentence in before fallacy. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-39477385346220604582012-11-28T14:39:38.327-05:002012-11-28T14:39:38.327-05:00Chris is right. Trying to vote yourselves liberty ...Chris is right. Trying to vote yourselves liberty is like trying to eat your way to being thin. The basic unit in society is the individual, not any group, especially a governmental one. Change the way you think. Depend on yourself, love those beside you and always turn away from evil. People will naturally follow.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-55594205301917019022012-11-28T14:31:05.535-05:002012-11-28T14:31:05.535-05:00Uh, no. We do not all agree that we'd vote fo...Uh, no. We do not all agree that we'd vote for Ron Paul.<br /><br />I love Ron Paul and what he's done to promote liberty, but I did not and will not participate in the violence and charade of the state's civil religion: voting.<br /><br />In a recent speech Ron Paul gave, he even had to admit that it takes some rationalization for him to square his libertarianism with participation Andrew Clarkhttp://curmudgeons.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3758330678390419129.post-4315900808594198272012-11-28T14:22:03.148-05:002012-11-28T14:22:03.148-05:00Silence is assent. That is how politicians view n...Silence is assent. That is how politicians view non-voters. The state gains far more from "voluntary" payment of taxes than from voting. That is why tax evasion is a crime but non-voting is permitted. The beneficiaries and enforcers of the state don't care if you don't vote, and are happy when their opponents detach from politics. It just makes it that much easier to Jonathan Jaechhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10379443520888976176noreply@blogger.com