Friday, November 9, 2018

Trump vs. Hayek on Immigrants


Today, President Trump answered questions from reporters before boarding Marine One.

One of the topics that came up was immigration. The president said that the nation needed more workers but that they would be allowed in on a "merit basis." He singled out the tech sector as a sector that needed workers.

How arrogant! Just how is it that the president is the one that knows what type of workers are needed everywhere in the country? Perhaps we also need more landscapers and crop pickers that would not pass the president's merit test.

The Nobel prize-winning economist F. A. Hayek warned about such a central planning mentality:
 The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design.
To the naive mind that can conceive of order only as the product of deliberate arrangement, it may seem absurd that in complex conditions order, and adaptation to the unknown, can be achieved more effectively by decentralizing decisions and that a division of authority will actually extend the possibility of overall order. Yet that decentralization actually leads to more information being taken into account.
The United States labor market is a fully functioning, complex market that draws workers into the sectors where they can deliver the most value. That President Trump is calling for a worker "merit-based" system to determine who is allowed into the country clearly demonstrates that he fails to understand how free markets work and why a central planner can never be as efficient in determining economic activity.

I discussed this further in the video below where President Trump's top adviser hailed the merit-based immigrant worker plan.



-RW 

14 comments:

  1. Again, there is very little evidence America needs any more immigration, especially from dirt world countries, even if they allegedly have any tech skills. I've yet to see any evidence that they would be libertarian or add any value to society. If cheap labor makes an economy wealthy, Africa and Central America should be booming. There is also the issue of dirt world diseases they could bring, but who wants to be called 'da rasis' over that.

    RW has yet to show that we need any immigration at all.

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    1. Re: The Lab Manager,

      ── Again, there is very little evidence America needs any more immigration[...] ──

      Statements like the above only serve to provide evidence of arrogance and conceit. You can't presume to know what others need or want. You can't presume to speak for 'America'. 'America' is a concept, a word, meant to facilitate and optimize communication. It isn't meant to mean something that exists outside the people that conform it.

      Many AMERICANS want immigrant labor. They say so through their actions.

      ── If cheap labor makes an economy wealthy, Africa and Central America should be booming. ──

      China is booming, and it has much more cheap labor. Africa - the continent - has 1.3 billion souls; China has 1.38 billion. So yes, cheap labor IS making the Chinese economy stronger and the people wealthier.

      http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/africa-population/
      https://populationof2018.com/china-population-2018.html

      The difference is how the state treats and defends private property. African countries are the result of independence movements or civil wars, with governments openly hostile to capital investment and private property. You can draw a distinction between a country like Botswana where institutions are more solidly established and a sound economy, and a country like Sudan, which has suffered internal strife since the 19th Century. The only thing that connects those two countries is that they exist in the same continent, that's all. These are different countries with very different populations, ethnically as well as genetically. There is in fact more genetic diversity in African peoples than in other populations. The fact that you can't go beyond their skin color is only evidence of your lack of culture and knowledge.

      http://www.nbcnews.com/id/30502963/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/africans-have-worlds-greatest-genetic-variation/#.W-nDDoWcFEY

      ── There is also the issue of dirt world diseases they could bring [...] ──

      You mean diseases like smallpox?

      https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-news-commentator-says-migrants-are-carrying-smallpox-a-disease-eradicated-in-1980

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  2. ── The president said that the nation needed more workers but that they would be allowed in on a "merit basis." ──

    "Merit basis" being code for: No non-Norwegians need apply.

    ── How arrogant! Just how is it that the president is the one that knows what type of workers are needed everywhere in the country? ──

    Do you doubt the great one's ability to personally manage the labor market of the whole country? Why, you're not being nationalistic enough! You don't want us to be tired of so much winning!

    ── [The president] fails to understand how free markets work[.] ──

    Trumpistas and the president have demonstrated their open hostility towards people's choices and Market forces. They most certainly care about their own business ──no one is saying they aren't self-interested── but show utter contempt towards the voluntary and mutually-beneficial exchanges and trades pursued by other Americans (not Trumpistas) with foreigners. Driven by pure jealousy ─"dem immigruntz takum er emergency rooms!"─ or envy ─"dem immigruntz takum er jebz!"─, they encourage the State to violently place itself between those peaceful individuals who are doing nothing except engage in commerce.

    Hayek: "Yet that decentralization actually leads to more information being taken into account."

    Which is exactly why the 'merit basis' immigration policy is a canard. The Market provides plenty of signals on its demand for labor, including immigrant labor. The president and his cheerleaders at Fox News and Fox Business (who abuse the pronoun "we") are too inclined to share the same delusion and conceit: that government can do all things better than the millions of human individuals of will.

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    1. There are no 'market forces' when it comes to immigration. The entire H1B type systems have become rent seeking systems for the corporatocracy that rules America. I do think more jobs appeared under Trump because his administration did repeal a lot of Obama regs that were crippling progress, however the true unemployment numbers are still dismal. Any educated person can look at LinkedIn and see the thousands of qualified Americans that could be employed but corporate America hates to pay a market wage for labor or ability.

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    2. If an immigrant worker can do the same job as an American for cheaper, then a company would be stupid not to hire the immigrant. The market is far too competitive to indulge inbred nativist fetishes.

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    3. Evan, don't they have American women they could hire instead? Supposedly they still make less on the dollar than men.

      Actually, the company would be stupid to hire the immigrant. Even some of my Indian friends hate talking to an Indian call center.

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    4. Re: The Lab Manager,

      ── There are no 'market forces' when it comes to immigration. ──

      Of course there are market forces at work. The market is the result of human action, of billions of daily transactions, all intertwined. People who hire immigrants are themselves the market forces. Immigrants to hear the signals and make the decision to migrate are the market forces.

      ── The entire H1B type systems have become rent seeking systems for the corporatocracy that rules America. ──

      But H1B visas aren't the only vehicle available to hire immigrant work. That's first. Second, the only thing that the H1B visa lottery does is make immigrant labor more accessible. The DECISION to hire an immigrant is part of the Market. You completely misunderstand what the market is and does. The Market is not a puppet-master. Instead, we human individuals of will ARE the Market.

      ── Evan, don't they have American women they could hire instead? ──

      Why would they? Just to please you?

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  3. Let's keep enjoying the wonders of open borders and celebrating diversity. Just saw this today:

    "An illegal immigrant accused of a triple murder in Missouri was previously jailed and released in New Jersey on domestic violence charges, authorities said, putting the spotlight on the conflict between local and immigration authorities nationwide.

    Luis Rodrigo Perez, 23, a native of Mexico, is charged with fatally shooting two men and wounding two others on Nov. 1 and fatally shooting a woman the next day."

    Just another anecdote? Nope.

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    1. What an idiotic argument. Do you understand the definition of "anecdote"?

      And I should add, he killed 10 fewer people than the white guy in Thousand Oaks. Should we deport whites?

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    2. RW: You keep talking about all of the "urban primitives" we already have, yet you want to import even more. Of course, not all immigrants are killers, but we aren't exactly getting the cream of the crop these days. It's because of this that very few people take free immigration/libertarian thinking seriously. You want to overlay open immigration over the Statist layabout system we currently have, until everything implodes. Why can't we get rid of the welfare system first? Is that too much to ask?

      Do you know what the definition of anecdote is? Stories like these immigrant-related crimes are very common, yet many so-called "libertarians" and leftists refuse to acknowledge them, thus referring to them as "anecdotes". Surely, you understand this?

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    3. Re: Chubba Dog,

      ── You keep talking about all of the "urban primitives" we already have, yet you want to import even more. ──

      Immigrants are not urban primitives. "Urban primitive" is the proper appellative for those unfortunate souls who are spewed out by the "Amerikan Pulbic Skool Seistem Dat Teeches Kudz To Red an Writ". Urban primitives do not wait in the parking lot of Lowe's for contractors to pick them up for various jobs.

      ── not all immigrants are killers, but we aren't exactly getting the cream of the crop these days. ──

      This "we" you bring up, to whom are you referring, Kemosabe?

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    4. Torres, you continue to split hairs over nothing. Don't be "idiotic", to quote a phrase. "We" meaning the US taxpayers that will foot the bill for these layabouts. Pretend all you want, but a libertarian utopia will not spring from the ashes of what is left, when everything collapses.

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    5. Re: Chubba Dog

      Your assertion that you speak for taxpayers is funny. You don't speak for anyone but yourself and your biases. You cannot presume to know the skills and abilities of people you haven't met. And I already showed you that you were lying throug your very teeth when repeating the canard that immigrants "cost the economy" or taxpayers, so don't even start again.

      --- but a libertarian utopia will not spring from the ashes of what is left, when everything collapses. ---

      That's rich. First you accused me of not being a real libertarian and now you pretend to insult me by claiming libertarianism is utopian.

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    6. Correct, for once, you're not a libertarian, you're a leftist, and, you've shown me nothing. Additionally, you do not command me as to what I can say, so I shall "start again" whenever I so choose. As for your assertion that I only speak for myself, Trump got elected for a reason, 'ya know. There are millions who think just like me - so I believe I do represent a large portion of the voting population. Someday you'll figure that out. Have a good night.

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